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Q. Hedging Crude
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Mathanakumaran  @mathancn
Sep 22 1:05 AM

Im not good in this technique i lose more money
mCxn00b @red
Sep 22 1:13 AM

You can hedge at 6.30 PM daily as there will be volatility. Buy and sell from same spot 2 lots in Sep and Oct contract. 15 points will hit either side.
Mathanakumaran  @mathancn
Sep 22 1:25 AM

@red if starts fall on one side 100 points one side we will lose our money but we ready to avg at any cost
Nithin Kumar @rudeCrude
Sep 22 1:26 AM

@red Great.. Why don't we hedge same expiry lot.. One in Intraday and another in Carryforward.. It may help during choppy market days, right??
Nithin Kumar @rudeCrude
Sep 22 1:29 AM

@mathancn if one hedges in such a one way market, I think the loss position to be carried for next day..
mCxn00b @red
Sep 22 1:32 AM

1. Fall/Rise of 100 points within 15-30 mins is purely news based and happens rarely. In hedging you have keep targets on both sides.
2. The disadvantage of hedging same contract two lots is 2 lots price is blocked. In hedging 2 separate contracts just a little over 1 lot price is blocked.
Nithin Kumar @rudeCrude
Sep 22 1:34 AM

Nice info.. But, What do you mean by "blocked"?
mCxn00b @red
Sep 22 1:39 AM

Blocked meaning margin. For example you have 60k and you wanna do positional and let's assume positional lot price is 48k. So that 48k is blocked giving you a buffer of 12k. If crude goes beyond 120 points opposite to Ur trade then you risk account getting squared off.
Nithin Kumar @rudeCrude
Sep 22 1:40 AM

Yes.. Now, got the point. Thanks a lot @red
mCxn00b @red
Sep 22 1:40 AM

Anytime brother 👍
Nithin Kumar @rudeCrude
Sep 22 1:42 AM

However, Margin getting blocked wouldn't be a problem for die-hard fans of Crude, like me. 😂
Nithin Kumar @rudeCrude
Sep 22 1:43 AM

Untill it gets released again..
Nithin Kumar @rudeCrude
Sep 22 1:53 AM

@red Hope you are aware of crude options, as well. Any idea about strike price difference and CE / PE for hedging??
mCxn00b @red
Sep 22 1:55 AM

Sorry brother I don't do options, so I'm not Ur man for that. Hope the pundits can help you on that.😊
Nithin Kumar @rudeCrude
Sep 22 2:06 AM

@red No issues.. I can make out from the above discussion. Anyone else can respond if more info is required.
Nithin Kumar @rudeCrude
Sep 22 2:09 AM

Actually, I feel hedging would work better positional trades, where the held positions may continue for more than a day.
Jyoti Soni @jyotisoni
Sep 22 4:28 AM

@rudeCrude we can deal one lot for jobbing n one lot for carry..
Nithin Kumar @rudeCrude
Sep 22 4:33 AM

Yes Madam.. I feel one leg of the hedge will always be profitable even if we carry both. Other one the other day.
Profitwaves @profitwaves
Sep 22 11:24 AM

Enter at correct time then no need to hedging...
Nithin Kumar @rudeCrude
Sep 22 1:19 PM

Adding a last query.. Did anyone try to hedge based on the discount price of a crude future given by the broker?
100 points - 10,000
But, Buy / Sell a Crude Future at 4000, an amount near Rs. 40000 will be locked from your capital (i.e.. Broker takes only Rs. 10 against 1 point of Crude Future given to you for trading)
Correct me, if I am wrong?
no one knows @lov
Sep 22 2:41 PM

You can hedge it on open the mkt and break it when you know where is support and resistance
mCxn00b @red
Sep 22 2:53 PM

If you want to hedge positional lot, then I would suggest do it on two separate contracts. It'll give you more time to hit both targets.
Example: Buy Sep at 4165, target let's assume 4215 (safe enough). At the same price let's say crude Oct is 4175. So sell from 4175 Oct contract. Target is 4100.
Now you you will have ample time for both targets to hit. But it may take time. So what generally I do is hedge MIS for small number of points. Generally 10-12. 15 if I'm very confident.
mCxn00b @red
Sep 22 2:56 PM

So you have to pick a spot in the day where you know crude will go 15 points either side. I have noticed 6.30 to be such a spot. There can be many such times. That you just have to observe and back test or forward test
Nithin Kumar @rudeCrude
Sep 22 2:57 PM

Cool Enough.. Thanks.
mCxn00b @red
Sep 22 2:59 PM

One last thing. If you observe in my example of hedging I have given 50 points for buy and 75 for sell.
Justification- what I believe Crude is already at a high, so I believe it'll go lower. So I would want to exit buy quickly and bank more on sell. So I have given more time to my more confident trade.
This analysis you should do as per your research.
Nithin Kumar @rudeCrude
Sep 22 3:02 PM

My research is much more deeper based on the broker's margin to buy / sell of a crude future. You can see my last message. I suppose we can mint money out of that difference as well. Not sure of, have to test anyways.
Mathanakumaran  @mathancn
Sep 22 3:05 PM

As per me edging is stupiod concept of losing capital money and brokerage too . If any news came immediately 500 points goes up if didnt back guys what u will do
Mathanakumaran  @mathancn
Sep 22 3:09 PM

Spin the coin ten times with good entry low sl and find the profit zone ( its may huge or less ) lets get good probability.
Nowdays crude is not so fair 100 to 150 points daily moments
While in 4525 itself i said to my frnds crude will reach 3996 back again i expect on last week but didnt HAPPENED
Mathanakumaran  @mathancn
Sep 22 3:13 PM

Final im not suggest any one in edge concept.in market we may find good opportunities on every day. ( i will get minum 5 entry )......
Mathanakumaran  @mathancn
Sep 22 3:15 PM

My 3 to 5 points sl and 13 points already completed on final stage testing losed 1.50 l to test real if its completed then we all start earn good .
Mathanakumaran  @mathancn
Sep 22 3:16 PM

As per me minum 3 points to 15 points sl is more than enough we dont go for more in future
Nithin Kumar @rudeCrude
Sep 22 3:18 PM

Agree your point when we are able to keep the least possible SL as you said... But, Instead of the conditions war like conditions, crude seems to be running around an average. Hope you have seen my last 3 month sheet shared on 6th Sept, we can pull a lot of insights from it. @mathancn
Nithin Kumar @rudeCrude
Sep 22 3:19 PM

On the other forum in FP, I remember @ygtrader has telling "Market discounts everything over a period of time"
Nithin Kumar @rudeCrude
Sep 22 3:20 PM

*ignore has
Nithin Kumar @rudeCrude
Sep 22 3:25 PM

Maybe you got the wrong meaning of what I meant by market discounts everything, I'm not talking about price reduction.
But what I'm saying is current market price takes into consideration all the information that can possibly affect price.
In another words efficient Market hypothesis.
And also I don't do the options hedging, so sorry I'll leave some other expert to help you with that
Nithin Kumar @rudeCrude
Sep 22 3:27 PM

Okay.. Sorry for wrong tag.
Nithin Kumar @rudeCrude
Sep 22 3:32 PM

@mathancn Your prediction was almost right at a gap of 100 points. The low of 19th was 4099.
Ajithkumar  @ajithkumar
Sep 23 4:35 PM

About 5 year back I hedged. It took almost 10 days to come out without much pain.exit perfection also matters.
Nithin Kumar @rudeCrude
Sep 23 5:05 PM

Let's see if I can come out of my current Hedge position, @ajithkumar Sir
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